This Is A Voice

Showing Up In The World part 2 - Refining your CV with vocal coach & career consultant Jeremy Fisher

April 03, 2023 Jeremy Fisher and Dr Gillyanne Kayes Season 7 Episode 4
This Is A Voice
Showing Up In The World part 2 - Refining your CV with vocal coach & career consultant Jeremy Fisher
Show Notes Transcript

What does your CV or resumé actually say about you? Is it up to date? Does it reflect who you are, what you want to do and who you want to work with?

Expert vocal coach & career consultant Jeremy Fisher shares his process for rewriting your CV to attract the clients and jobs you want.
Together Gillyanne and Jeremy discuss the right questions to ask, and share several examples of different CVs for teachers and singers.

If you want your career to take off, you need to lead with your CV.
Listen to this short This Is A Voice podcast episode, then book your session with Jeremy asap!

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[00:00:00] Jeremy: This is a voice, a podcast with Dr. Gillyanne Kayes and jeremy Fisher, this is a voice. Hello, and welcome to This Is A Voice, season seven, episode four.

[00:00:25] Gillyanne: The podcast where we get Vocal about voice. 

[00:00:28] Jeremy: I'm Jeremy Fisher. 

[00:00:28] Gillyanne: And I'm Dr. Gillyanne Kayes. 

[00:00:30] Jeremy: And today we are talking about your resume, your CV, your curriculum vitae. So I'm gonna start straight away with 

[00:00:37] Gillyanne: curriculum vitae.

[00:00:39] Jeremy: No, it's, it's Latin. I did Latin. I did Latin at school. 

[00:00:41] Gillyanne: Showing our age. 

[00:00:43] Jeremy: What is the purpose of a CV? Answers on a postcard, please to Vocal Process. What is the purpose of a CV? Why is it there? What's it doing? Because if you know what the purpose is, then you actually know what angle to take when you write it.

[00:00:59] Gillyanne: Yeah. because there are different types of CV, aren't there? I mean I have a CV which is more of an academic one. So if I would be wanting to apply to take part in a research project at a university or something like that, you know, I'd have all of those kind of heavy duty credentials on there. I can remember sending a CV to the German Voice Clinic in order to apply to do some observation there in the clinic.

[00:01:26] And I wrote a different kind of CV there about all the professional development I've done, times I've been in voice clinics, et cetera, et cetera. So it'll be very typical that you will have different types of CV. Absolutely. I mean, one of the things that we're gonna talk about today is a process that you went through really with our Registered Accredited Trainers.

[00:01:49] Yep. As to what was the best way to write a CV that would be shown on our website. 

[00:01:55] Jeremy: Yes. A lot of our accredited teachers are performers as well as teachers. And the question came up, should I have one CV or two?

[00:02:04] Should I have a teacher CV and a performer CV? And actually the answer is, it depends. because with that particular, the person who asked the question then they, they really did need two separate CVs because the type of performing that she was doing, they didn't wanna know about her teaching and the type of teaching that she was doing might want to know what type of things she was performing, but weren't that interested in the details. However, there was one person on the website that I rewrote there with CV for, who is a leading lady in musical theater. And her credentials are so powerful that I wanted to list some of the places that she's been. Because as a teacher, she is bringing her very high level experience of performing into the coaching studio situation. So it was actually really important that I listed a lot of her leading lady roles. 

[00:02:57] Gillyanne: Mm. Because her goal is to coach people for auditions. Yeah. And prepare them for roles, sharing her experience as a leading lady over what period of 20 years.

[00:03:08] Jeremy: Yes. And we're going to do names and we're going to do examples. So that is Anna Thorén, who is Swedish by birth, but now living in Hamburg and working in Hamburg. And she has been leading lights in Roman Polanski's dance to the Vampires, which is a cult musical. Tarzan, she's done Elphaba in Wicked. She's done Donna in Mamma Mia.

[00:03:28] Yeah. Margeurite in the Scarlet Pimpernel, Marie Antoinette, title role, Lucy in Jekyll and Hyde. She has done so many high profile musical theater roles and so she teaches becoming a singing storyteller. She's also very good on technique, so she will help you with power sounds, contemporary musical theater sounds lighter pop stuff.

[00:03:48] Gillyanne: And also the physicality of performance because, you know, she has so much experience as a stage animal.

[00:03:54] Jeremy: Yes. So it was actually really important when writing her CV to say, this is what I've done, here on my credentials. Anna is actually one of the very few people that I said to all of our accredited trainers I want your credentials of the roles because of, of the, the profile that she's got.

[00:04:10] Mm. With everybody else. I made a particular decision, and I'll come to that in a moment. What I want to say is, Should you do a long CV or should you do a short CV? 

[00:04:23] Gillyanne: Can I just interject here, which is, I think with quite a few of them, first of all, we said more or less that we wanted a paragraph, 

[00:04:31] Jeremy: we said a hundred to 150 words.

[00:04:33] Yeah. Which completely freaked everyone.

[00:04:36] Gillyanne: And we also wanted an elevator pitch, which I want you to talk about in a minute. Yeah. It's very tempting to put everything you've ever done on your CV. Please do not do that. 

[00:04:49] Jeremy: I cannot, I cannot think of a circumstance for going to any job when you are already in the business where you list where you went to college.

[00:04:58] It just makes no sense to me at all. It's like college is an entirely separate entity. It's a complete world of its own. Actually, it has very little impact on the business. Once you've had, once you've got two or three roles or two or three jobs, that's it. And the idea that you say what high school you went to is just nonsensical.

[00:05:16] So it's really interesting because my next question is chronological or highlights? Mm. The number of CVs that I have seen, because I do CV rewriting quite a lot now for the people that I work with. And The number of chronological CVs is extraordinary. It's like you think I'm going to read, you know, which performances you did 17 years ago?

[00:05:39] Not interested. I want to know what you've done recently. I want to know highlights. I want to know, I want to get a flavor of you and really what's, what's the purpose of a CV is exactly this. I want to get the flavor of you. Whatever flavor you want to present to me, I'll take it. So if you wanna present to me that you are a chronological squirrel, then I'll take that and I'm going, well, how will that benefit me?

[00:06:02] If you want to give me the, the flavor that you are a high level performer and you wanna do performance coaching, I'll take that too. What was so interesting about the CVs is the focus of almost every CV that I saw, bar 2, I wasn't sure who I was dealing with. Mm. It was a list of facts. 

[00:06:24] Okay. Next question.

[00:06:27] Third person or first person? Mm. Third person is, Jeremy has done this in his life. Jeremy did that. Jeremy did this. Jeremy is this person, and first person is, I've done this, I did that. This is who I am. And I made the decision that I wanted first person on the website. 

[00:06:47] Gillyanne: I think this is really important because teaching is an energy exchange.

[00:06:51] Yes. And people need to see that essence of you so that they can connect with it. And I think it's important. Don't be afraid to show up as you. 

[00:07:03] Jeremy: Mm. It was very interesting because in rewriting, when you take somebody's CV that's written in the third person, there is something slightly safer about writing in the third person then you can say, Jeremy is an amazing performer. But when you say I am an amazing performer, it's so much more intimate and it's so much more powerful and it's so much more scary.

[00:07:26] So it was very interesting taking some of the third person writing that people had done and turning it around and going, are you actually comfortable sitting behind this phrase? 

[00:07:36] Gillyanne: I was just thinking, Jeremy, that a situation that might be different would be if you were as we are, the CEO of your company.

[00:07:48] And it might then be more suitable to have it in the third person. 

[00:07:53] Jeremy: I'm gonna go back to who is it aimed at? And if you are aimed at stuffy, then yes, absolutely. If you are aimed at open and personal, then no, don't do third person. What we wanted on the website was that everybody who read the CVs and saw the photographs got a connection with that person straight away.

[00:08:13] And "I" language is the quickest way to do that. 

[00:08:16] Gillyanne: And a lot of the Registered Accreds have had as part of their their mentoring sessions this year, they've had a session with you on, well on, on their career. Yes. You know, and their career growth and how it, how it's shaping up. 

[00:08:31] Jeremy: I do a lot of career coaching now.

[00:08:33] Gillyanne: And Jeremy, you've helped them then to shape their CVs as a result of those conversations, haven't you?

[00:08:39] Jeremy: It, it has been absolutely fascinating because the question I open with is, who are you? 

[00:08:44] Gillyanne: And they're all different. And that's really important.

[00:08:47] Jeremy: I think that comes across because we have the, you, we have popups that show each person and then they're on a slider, so you can actually move from one person to the next.

[00:08:56] And every time you read a CV, it is a completely different experience. And so you get as far as we can do it, you get the, that person that you're reading, their personality comes through. The way that they work, the language that they use is all their language. I'm just sort of shifting things around and going, can I word it like this? Are you happy with that language? 

[00:09:16] Gillyanne: Can we go back to the elevator pitch? because I'm looking at Anna Thorén's CV right here. Yeah. And there are two sentences, or is it one sentence? 

[00:09:26] Jeremy: One sentence I said to people, if you had to describe, the elevator pitch is a really interesting thing, process to go through. If you had to describe yourself in three sentences or 30 seconds, you are 30 seconds in the lift with the person that you want to influence.

[00:09:41] Or the, the person that you want to pay attention to what you're doing. How do you describe yourself? The number of people who said, I have no idea. I have no idea. I dunno how to do it. And from the, the, the episode that we've just recorded, when we were talking about the website, it was very difficult for us to describe ourselves because we cover so much area.

[00:10:02] And because we have so many resources that we've created. So the question is how do you describe yourself? How are you gonna grab someone's attention in three sentences or 30 seconds? 

[00:10:14] Gillyanne: Can I read this? Yes. And then maybe we'll look at one or two others. So this is Anna's. My expertise is in modern musical, power sounds lighter pop sounds, and connecting text and feeling with music to become a singing storyteller.

[00:10:31] Jeremy: Absolutely. 

[00:10:32] Gillyanne: Job done. 

[00:10:33] Jeremy: Really, really clear. And I want to go to one of the people on the list who now this is one of the CVs that somebody submitted and I said, I don't want to change a word. It's you. It's beautiful. I love it. Here is her opening sentence. Similar to the surroundings, my singing studio in the South Lakes offers an oasis of calm where clients can come to explore their voices in a safe and inviting environment.

[00:11:02] And that's Tracie Penwarden Allan. And that absolutely sums up the vibe of her studio. 

[00:11:07] Gillyanne: You know exactly how you're going to feel when you have that lesson. You know how you're going to be cared for. Yes. It's, honestly, Tracie, it's just beautiful.

[00:11:18] Jeremy: Beautiful. And I mean, she was so shocked when I said, I don't wanna change the word.

[00:11:21] It's gorgeous. So I'm gonna read the rest of her CV because she's written all of this herself. Wow. 

[00:11:27] My clients range from eight to 80 years of age, and each decade brings something quite special and unique. Clients attend for a variety of reasons. Children just starting out on their Vocal journey. Older children needing to further their Vocal technique whilst preparing for auditions and adults who want to explore their personal Vocal achievement. My passion is to work with you by exploring your voice and then, with strategic guidance, help you in finding your voice, whilst giving you the support and guidance you require.

[00:11:57] I continue to enjoy working on the concert platform and directing choirs, however, teaching in my studio is my happy place. I love nothing more than sharing my experiences of the last 28 years and my knowledge gained by my continuing extensive training with you, the client. And I absolutely love. It's just gorgeous.

[00:12:17] Every word. Yes. So that's Tracie. And the thing is either you love that and you want to find out more and you just go, ah, no. Can't be bothered with that. And that is the point of a CV. Yes. And I want, my next question was, or my next statement is, not everyone will like your CV. 

[00:12:36] Gillyanne: Well, it's not that they won't like it, but you know 

[00:12:38] Jeremy: No, it, no, it genuinely is.

[00:12:40] It really is. The haters will be out there going, what a load of rubbish. Oh, touchy-feely rubbish. Oh, I dunno. And I'm going, no. 

[00:12:47] Gillyanne: Well, it made me cry actually. Well, me too. 

[00:12:50] Jeremy: In a good way. I wanted to find out more. So the next question is, are the haters really your clients? And the answer is no. And if the haters aren't your clients, don't write your CV for them.

[00:13:04] Write the CV for the people that you want to attract. Yeah. It was very interesting. 

[00:13:09] Gillyanne: But that's a really core thing, isn't it? 

[00:13:10] Jeremy: Oh that's huge. 

[00:13:11] Gillyanne: That we had to help them with when they were writing their CVs.

[00:13:15] Jeremy: It came up several times. That people were going, well, I don't know how the other teachers in my area are going to react to the way that you've rewritten my, my CV.

[00:13:26] I love it, but I don't, I dunno about other people. Mm. And I'm going The singing teachers in your area are not your clients. Mm. They are not the people that you are wanting to attract. They can hate you, they can dislike you, they can ignore you. They can just go, meh, don't care. Yes. Doesn't matter, because they are not your clients.

[00:13:44] The point is that your CV is written specifically to the person that you want to attract. And when I'm doing a coaching session about, helping people redo their resume, this is, if you like, it's the place I start, which is, who do you want to be working with in six months time? Because that's who your CV is aimed at.

[00:14:04] Really, really interesting question and we've got so many fascinating answers, and it's one of the ways that the people on the Accreditation Programme have started to understand where they fit in the teaching world. 

[00:14:15] Gillyanne: Yeah. And in biz speak, that's called finding your ideal client. Yes. And sometimes it's important to have that conversation with a teacher because I think we've spoken about this in the previous podcast. You don't have to teach anybody and everybody. Yes. That's not a definition of success. The definition of success is you feel satisfied with the client base you are currently working with, and they are satisfied in working with you.

[00:14:42] Absolutely. So let's talk through a couple more on how you helped those people write their CVs. 

[00:14:50] Jeremy: This is Louisa Morgan and Louisa Morgan is somebody who came to meet, actually to do a, a career coaching session quite a long time ago. And she said, I don't know where I'm going. And so we, we worked on what it was that she had, what her, if you like, her unique selling points are, what her skill sets are, and who they're aimed at.

[00:15:13] And she came up with the elevator pitch, "confident voices, successful auditions", which again, absolutely sums up what she does. I love it. So here's her CV in the way that it was rewritten. 

[00:15:26] Learn how to tell a story and take your audition technique to the next level. Grow from a relatively confident singer to a captivating performer.

[00:15:35] Love that. Me too. Mm. As a trained director, actor, and singing coach, I will help you apply, tried and tested acting techniques to your songs. I love working with performers on their technical voice work and finding the storytelling elements in acting through your song. I work with performers age 15 to 21, who are aiming for the performing arts industry.

[00:15:55] Gillyanne: And that's nice because it's very so specific. Specific, yeah. 

[00:15:59] Jeremy: So specific. And it's like, here is my target market. I love that. What I also love is that, Louisa is genuinely somebody who crosses the boundary between acting coach and spoken voice work, and singing voice work and singing teacher, singing coach. 

[00:16:13] Gillyanne: Yes. Very much so. 

[00:16:14] Jeremy: So that really does reflect what she does. I teach the acting students at the Cygnet Theater in Exeter and musical theatre students at Italia Conti, as well as running a busy private practice. 

[00:16:24] Gillyanne: And it is busy. 

[00:16:25] Jeremy: Yeah. I have a great track record for getting young actors and singers into top schools, including gse.

[00:16:30] Sorry. Gsa GSA Guildford School of Acting RCS, Royal Conservatoire of Scotland, RWCMD, the Royal Welsh College of Music and Drama, Trinity Laban, Bird, and many more. If you want to audition preparation, acting through song work or spoken voice coaching, contact me here. And again, really, really clear about what she has to offer.

[00:16:53] So I know she's thrilled with that. 

[00:16:54] Gillyanne: So, nice job, Louisa. 

[00:16:55] Jeremy: Yes. So just really fascinating working with everybody to find what it is that they do and what their unique skills are and what they have to offer. So we're gonna do another one, which is Jan Jinkerson. Jan's out in Norfolk. And it took a little bit of time to get exactly the flavor of what Jan does because when you watch her teach, the thing that you, the, there's two things that you really get from watching Jan teaching somebody.

[00:17:24] One is calm. Mm. She has the most amazing way of sort of projecting calm across the internet. Really, really fascinating. And the other is her skill as a contemporary commercial teacher. Mm. So this is 

[00:17:40] Gillyanne: And singer.

[00:17:40] Jeremy: And singer. This is hers. This is Jan Jinkerson. If you are looking to hone your riffing skills or would like more confidence with creating ad libs, melodic variations, or improvisation, I will create tailored exercises and gradient steps for you.

[00:17:56] I'm a singing teacher, working cross genre, specializing in CCM, that's contemporary commercial music, to help clients find their voice and fulfill their potential in a safe and informal environment. 

[00:18:07] Gillyanne: That's really important, isn't it? The safe and informal 

[00:18:10] Jeremy: It is, and it's exactly how she works. Mm-hmm.

[00:18:13] Originally trained as a classical singer. I studied at BIMM, the famous Brighton Institute of Modern Music, where I obtained an H Dip in modern music (Distinction). I sing with the John Whitehead Jazz Trio, the Mark and JJ Duo, acoustic, Pop, soul, Funk, and the Soho Blues band. I also run a women's CCM choir called the Acapella Brawds. 

[00:18:34] Which I love. And this, this actually, oh, it's a short CV. There is so much packed into that. And you go, I see acoustic pop, soul, funk. 

[00:18:44] Gillyanne: I see the genre that I want to sing in. 

[00:18:46] Jeremy: I I see the genre. I see that you're a performer. I see that you have a very high exam result yourself in a very high level institute that I know about

[00:18:58] Gillyanne: that also works with modern music.

[00:19:01] Jeremy: Yep. Yeah, I see that you specialize in contemporary commercial music. So, and I see particularly that you will help me on riffing, improvisation, and adlibs.

[00:19:10] Gillyanne: So I know I'm gonna have fun. Yes. And I think that's really important. 

[00:19:14] Jeremy: And, and calm, Doing these CVs has been really interesting and I want just wanna talk about the process that we go through.

[00:19:20] Gillyanne: Oh, can I just say that with Jan, because her photograph is her singing with a microphone, that tells you something very important as well doesn't it? It tells you how she's going to work with you, that she's used to working with a microphone and that she sings in that kind of a setting.

[00:19:40] Jeremy: Absolutely. Yeah. So the process I go through with people for their CVs, and honestly, I'm happy to do this with anyone because I actually really enjoy doing this. 

[00:19:48] Gillyanne: It's your funky thing.

[00:19:49] Jeremy: I love it. Yeah. I love doing it. Yeah. The first thing I ask for is the CV that they already have. Send me your resume as it already is. Send me any version of your resume. I actually have five different versions of mine. 

[00:20:02] Gillyanne: Yeah. Or a link to your website or whatever. 

[00:20:04] Jeremy: However, however it works for you. I need to see what you're saying about yourself already. And then I get you to answer a few questions. The first one of which is, who do you want to be working with in six months time?

[00:20:16] Gillyanne: Or where do you want to be working? 

[00:20:17] Jeremy: Or where do you, you know, , do you want to be working in an institute? What are, what or who are you targeting? Hmm. And I think that's really important. I want to know what level of student you are comfortable working with. If you are somebody, and this is really interesting because one of our Accredited teachers in Australia discovered during doing the Accreditation, that she, she didn't think that she, she liked working with sort of early and, and young teen and sort of mid-teen voices.

[00:20:49] But what she discovered during the process is actually she loved doing that. 

[00:20:53] It's her happy place. 

[00:20:54] It was her happy place. And so we changed the CV to reflect that she loves working with young voices. So if that's the question, if that's the case for you, then let me know that. 

[00:21:03] Gillyanne: And not only is her studio full, yes, but she has actually been presenting as an industry leader in that area, in her local ANATS chapter. 

[00:21:14] Jeremy: That's the Australian National Association of Teachers of Singing, I think. 

[00:21:19] Gillyanne: Something like that. Let's just say ANATS, shall we? 

[00:21:22] Jeremy: Yeah. So I want to know, who do you want to work with? I can tell you that I absolutely love working with musical theater aged 18 to 25.

[00:21:34] And highly experienced performers. I love working with opera singers. Age 25 upwards. The, the age range for that is later because the development is later. Mm. So, and I love working with vocal coaches particularly and teachers, because for me that's about clarification. 

[00:21:53] Gillyanne: We didn't actually mention Naomi's name, the title of her studio.

[00:21:59] We should do that. We should, having sung her praises, 

[00:22:03] Jeremy: Naomi Lewandoski and yeah. Northside Voice Studio, north Northside Voice Studio. Which is in Australia. Yeah, 

[00:22:12] Gillyanne: I think it's, Sydney, 

[00:22:14] Jeremy: I think it's Sydney as well. So yes. And you'll find all of these CVs on the new website.

[00:22:21] So the process I basically, I'm getting information from people and I want answers to those questions, which is, who do you wanna be working with, and do you have a, if you like, do you have an age range or a professional level that you really enjoy working with? Some of our teachers only want to work with professional singers already.

[00:22:38] Some of our teachers only really love working with amateur or recreational singers. Some of our teachers want to work particularly with the 10 to 16 age range. So it's like whatever floats your boat, whatever vibe you want to give, whatever you know. If you think you're gonna work really well with, let me know.

[00:22:59] Gillyanne: And if it is your full area, you will shine at it. Oh yes. And that's really important. Yes. 

[00:23:06] Jeremy: So there, you know, there's a few more questions that I ask, which is basically to find out what areas you feel comfortable in. You don't even feel that you need to excel in them. You just need to feel comfortable. Also most important, what areas don't you excel in? What do you NOT wanna do? What are you uncomfortable with? Who are you uncomfortable working with? And I think that's really interesting because we are narrowing down the area that you are gonna excel in. It's like your central focus. And then I rewrite the CV using your phrases because I will talk to you.

[00:23:40] There was one wonderful moment where and this was with Franka Van Essen, who's in the Netherlands. Franka is already a very good writer, but she doesn't realize it yet. And 

[00:23:50] Gillyanne: I'm going to check out her blogs and vlogs. Absolutely. They're absolutely gorgeous. 

[00:23:55] Jeremy: I'm gonna be quoting some of the stuff that she's written because it's so good.

[00:24:00] And we were having a coaching session and I'll always record the coaching sessions. And she was talking about her view of coaching and how it looks. And I, I basically stopped the recording and I said, you need to write about this because this is your Falling Off A Log area you need to take, you need to transcribe exactly what you've just said.

[00:24:21] Mm. Create a blog about it and people will know what you do from that. There's no advertising required. You just write the blog and people will go, wow, that's amazing. I want to talk to this person. So very interesting process. So I get all the information and then I start to rework and it's like a jigsaw puzzle, really.

[00:24:40] It's like, does this piece belong in this jigsaw or does it belong in a different one? Can I move things around? How am I gonna start the CV? How am I gonna finish it? Where are we going with it? What is this CV saying to the reader? 

[00:24:54] Gillyanne: And following that metaphor, then what happens is that you see that person Yes.

[00:25:00] And what it is that they have. Yes. Yeah, clever you. 

[00:25:04] Jeremy: And that's really it. It's, I have to tell you, this is one of my Falling Off A Log areas. I find it fun. I find it really interesting. I'm good at it. And I actually like finding the essence of that person so that their CB really does reflect who they are and isn't just a list of facts.

[00:25:21] Now the CVs that I'm writing for the for the new website are very much geared towards students because they are teacher CVs. But I have also rewritten performer CVs. I've written conductor CVs. So I love doing that sort of stuff. If you want your CV rewritten, it's normally just one session. Yeah. 

[00:25:42] Gillyanne: Or it's an hour. If you want to have a career development session. 

[00:25:47] Career development. 

[00:25:48] That is something you are really, really good at this. 

[00:25:51] Jeremy: I love it. Yeah. And the whole point of a career development session is it's your career, not mine. So I have no, 

[00:25:57] Gillyanne: in this sense, you are a true coach. Yes. You don't have an agenda. 

[00:26:03] Jeremy: No, no. Because it's like, you know, the career advice that I give is not my career. It's not even something I would necessarily want to do. It's about what you want to do and how that works. 

[00:26:15] Gillyanne: Mm. A coach doesn't tell you what to do. 

[00:26:17] Jeremy: No. Well, very occasionally, tiny points. 

[00:26:18] Gillyanne: There might be action points, but the action points come outta that exchange where you find out what it is that that person, you help that person realize what they want. Absolutely. Yeah.

[00:26:32] Jeremy: Absolutely. And again, for me, this is about clarification and clarity. And if you like, my true Falling Off A Log for want of a better word, calling is about clarification. And it almost doesn't matter what industry I'm in or what person I'm working with. I want to help you be clearer about what you do yourself.

[00:26:52] And I might just ask questions. I might throw in some suggestions. I might give you some things that you never thought of occasionally I give homework. But there, yeah, I love doing that. So if you want that for yourself, if you actually wanna invest in your future, then please book a session with me because I would love to do that.

[00:27:11] So that's the CV story. I think we've probably done, 

[00:27:15] Gillyanne: I think we're done too. We'd love to hear from you. send us an email posting comments. Yep. And you know, 

[00:27:22] Jeremy: go and check out the new website. and 

[00:27:28] Gillyanne: have, have a little read of the the section, which is Meet the Team and look at the CVs of the Accredited Teachers, because I hope it'll inspire you.

[00:27:40] Jeremy: Absolutely. So we'll see you soon. Bye.

[00:27:45] This is a Voice, a podcast with Dr. Gillyanne Kayes and Jeremy Fisher.